Sun/Saturn Aspects

bonsai tree

Bonsai tree via plantsplantsplants.tumblr.com

Self-limiting behavior. Limited self-expression. Holding back creativity. Hard workers. Task-oriented people. Walking the straight and narrow. Principals. Teachers. Authorities. Rule makers rather than rule breakers. Law enforcers. Hardened personalities. Fragile, brittle egos. Self-disciplined. Stern. People who get noticed for their self-discipline. People who get noticed for how they do or do not follow the rules. People who get noticed because of their self-denial. Denying yourself freedom of self-expression. Denying your personal creativity. Denying your creative power. Feeling cut off from yourself. Dry self-expression. Serious self-expression. No time for fun and games. Life is serious business. Taking yourself too seriously. No sense of humor. No sense of play. Mature attitudes. Fuddy duddy. Fuss pots.

Getting into the business of life. Having a matter of fact attitude. Being really hard on yourself. Not forgiving yourself for errors and mistakes. Self-censorship. Rigid standards. Crystallized ego forces. Being your own authority. Making your own rules. Creative structure. Self-structuring. Creating schedules, routines and daily structures for your life. Finding yourself through experiences that require discipline and hard work. Pushing toward success. Living with restrictions. Thriving when you have restrictions placed upon you. People who feel more comfortable within structured environments. Structure gives personal freedom. Structure gives creative license. Having routines, habits and daily structures keeps you in check and helps you get what you want out of life. Understanding your limits. Being realistic about your personal limits – and working with them. Testing yourself. Being your own taskmaster. Feeling that other people are always testing you. Life is a test. Feeling that other people impose restrictions on your personal freedom.

Easy authority. Proper. Pruning back excess. “Tight” self-expression. Dried-out husk of a person. Depression. Dourness. Lack of vitality. Melancholy. Bleak outlook. Cutting back excess. Living an austere life. Self-deprivation. Scrooges. Making do with less. Having a very focused core self. Builders. Long-term planners. Understanding how events unfold over time. Realizing that it may take a long time to get what you want – but pushing ahead to get it anyway. Planning to live to be a ripe old age. Getting along better with older people. Seeking out older mentors and eventually being a mentor or teacher. Having the wisdom of someone much older. Super conservative. Business executives. Droll. Dull. Lack of creativity. Lack of spontaneity. Grandfatherly types. Heads of dynasties. Growing into yourself as you get older. Late bloomers. Fear mongers. People who hold back and feel fearful or intimidated to express themselves. Learning to keep all of areas of your life “in shape.”

bonsai tree with owls

Photo via mossandterrarium.tumblr.com

Having a need to be recognized for your hard work. Needing to be recognized for what you accomplish. Difficult or limited relationships with men. Being cut off from your father. Being cut off from your own sense of inner authority. Taking the hard line. Lack of empathy from men. Never feeling good enough. Inadequacy. Dad was a disciplinarian. Dad had high expectations and standards. Dad pushed you toward achievement. Dad kept you on a schedule. Dad structured your life.

People with Sun/Saturn aspects:

  • Karl Lagerfeld: Sun biquintile Saturn
  • Wesley Snipes: Sun opposite Saturn
  • Salvador Dali: Sun square Saturn
  • Ellen Page: Sun quintile Saturn
  • Thandie Newton: Sun biquintile Saturn
  • Sting: Sun conjunct Saturn
  • Jack Lalanne: Sun square Saturn
  • Apolo Anton Ohno: Sun sesquiquadrate Saturn
  • Clint Eastwood: Sun quincunx Saturn
  • Venus Williams: Sun square Saturn
  • Serena Williams: Sun conjunct Saturn
  • Dr. Dre: Sun conjunct Saturn

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120 Responses to “Sun/Saturn Aspects”

  1. Low Gale Haze says:

    It fits me perfectly, mainly when you’re talking about problems with self expression or being too hard on yourself. I had few problems with my dad, my mother was much more active in my life and she was kinda rigid, but I guess it all starts with me pushing myself too hard to surpass my own limitations or just doing nothing about anything because I know that I won’t be awesome. I need recognition, even if it’s just one person. I have a loose square with these two, but there’s also uranus conjunct my saturn near enaough to have the square with my sun. Both uranus and saturn are conjunct my ascendant, but they’re in house 12. Most of the effects are magnified by saturn being in sag and sun being in vir, since they’re related to perfectionism and breaking limits (wich may also be uranus’ influence).

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    • Michelle says:

      I often wonder about how people personally experience the conjunction of planets that have such different influence, like Saturn/Uranus.

      How do you fare with stretching your limits while respecting your need for perfection?

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      • Low Gale Haze says:

        This is indeed a good question. I guess I oftenly just don’t respect my needs for perfection, wich makes me bully myself afterwards for not being good enough or never going to be good enough at something. But sometimes this need for perfection is the main reason for me to stretch my limitations.
        I guess that this trait also gives me some kind of optimism (maybe because of sag) related to progress, even though I find progress oriented people annoying.
        They are also biquintile my venus in the 8th house, wich makes me fond of steampunk environments and outfits with vintage and modern elements.
        But my saturn square to my sun oftenly just makes me lay down and do nothing because I think it would be kinda innapropriate. The square made by uranus and sun makes me feel unconfortable with any group of people. At least I have some outbursts of rage that let’s me express my feelings (through attitudes, writing or just wearing certain match ups of colors stuff).

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        • Michelle says:

          fond of steampunk environments and outfits with vintage and modern elements.
          That’s awesome! I’m a lover of fashion, especially styles of self-expression that are bold, creative and dramatic and that show the wearer has the guts to do his own thing (Venus at 00 Aries trine Moon in Leo with Venus biquintile Uranus in Scorpio).

          What sign is Venus in?

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          • Low Gale Haze says:

            Venus in leo, trine mars in aries, sextile jupiter in gemini, semisquare sun in vrigo, quintile mercury in libra, square pluto in scorpio and the biquintiles with uranus and saturn. Also a quincux with my asc in capricorn and opposite my pallas in aquarius. I don’t know if I can call myself a real lover of fashion, but I delight myself observing how people express themselves with their clothes. I also love how clothes can be used as masks as well. Anyway, I just feel plain when it comes to all those people I see around the city. Oh, and I just don’t like too much all those clothes that are on vogue that everyone else wears, just because it’s too repetitive. Even thoug, I really am happy to see all those plaid shirts on cute girls nowadays.

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            • Leah-nine says:

              How do you think the Venus/Pluto square manifests or affects you? I have the same ordeal in my chart. Which houses are yours?

              I don’t really like Vogue fashion either. And I, too, often feel plain around ‘stylish’ people. I think we’ll just to figure out a way to be our own fashion icons :)

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              • Michelle says:

                I feel plain when I go to the city too. But, it inspires me to make a bigger effort. I can’t dress to the nines every day, but I still admire people who do.

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              • Low Gale Haze says:

                Well, this square tends to make me kinda interested in taboos in general. It also gives me a scorpian shade to my feelings and romantic situations. I like to feel everything in the highest voltage. I enjoy passion itself. But, as it’s a square, it’s always blocking me someway. I only have platonic loves. I use too much energy to approach my target and it’s often kinda too scary to them. And even thoug I strive for passion, I feel like all I want is just sex and no emotional envolvement. I guess that it makes me very jealous of everyone and too much aware of how being someone nice and enjoyable gives power to you, since I really envy this kind of people to the bones. Even though, I just think I can’t be that powerful without being fake, and I hate to be fake.
                Oh yeah, pluto is in the 11th and venus is in the 8th, wich gives more scorpian effects to venus.

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                • billow says:

                  At least you are honest about where you are at so the other is making a decision on where you feel you are at. Those manipulators can be pretty darn crafty. It’s a social trap. I practice common courtesy as much as I can, friendly comes easy for me, but I don’t really take it much further than that in the moment. Using courtesy to get, well I kinduv have a problem with that. Puke!!!!!

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                • Leah-nine says:

                  Wow. I can totally relate to all of that. –I have Venus in a Leo stellium in the 11th, square Pluto in Scorp in the 2nd. I have the same feelings about relationships and the same thing tends to happen with me sexually too: Relationships become a power struggle, and since I have Chiron in the mix near Venus also, I hate showing my emotions, so I try to connect but end up focusing on sex because it feels safe. And I know what you mean about being powerful but fake! I think that’s a Scorpionic fear- not wanting to show true, real feelings or thoughts because it’ll put you in a weak position.

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                  • Low Gale Haze says:

                    The funny part is that chiron is also in the mix, being semi-sextile to my venus and trine my pluto.

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                  • billow says:

                    Oh come on, face it, sex is just good clean fun. The worst thing is partnering with someone who doesn’t bust it loose because they are afraid there may be strings attached. Did I just write that? Caution: Mercury is still rx.

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      • Leah-nine says:

        I think it adds a level of dynamism if expressed positively, imbalance and confusion when energy is blocked somehow or expressed on a low vibrational frequency. For instance, my Capricorn stellium (4/5th H Placidus/Whole) with Uranus, Neptune, Saturn all 7 degrees apart can be a source of great spontaneous inspiration that is both spiritual-airy-fairy and grounded and practical. Conversely, some days overly-sober Saturn makes impressionable Neptune feel depressed, and then Uranus wants freedom from the negative thought patterns created by its house-siblings, which causes a lot of inner tension and discord.

        I can tell you though, however the energy manifests, it’s never superficial and often lacks light-heartedness.

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      • Flavio says:

        — I often wonder about how people personally experience the conjunction of planets that have such different influence, like Saturn/Uranus. —

        I have the sextile, and I personally feel saturn provides me with the basis, the ground for positive uranian maneuvers. Very much like an inventor gets good insights thanks, partly, to his knowledge of hard science.

        I had a girlfriend with a healthy and powerful Saturn high in her mid-heaven, on the last degrees of her ninth house. Our relationship was defined, I feel, by last year’s back and forth transiting “playful” Uranus in the last degrees of piscis, Which hit her natal saturn at least twice.

        Uranus is powerful in my chart, so during this relationship, I felt strongly inspired by her to pursue astrology and occultism, obsessively yet productively. I felt the transiting uranus was activated in my life by her high natal Saturn, even though she has no conscious knowledge of occultism.

        I felt she came to my life to help me realize the big picture of my natal chart. I always got the feeling that her saturn provided the fertile ground for my uranian potential to develop. All that in a very synchronical way, with no intentions from her part, just a spontaneous realization. I felt she was kind of a unconscious, spontaneous mentor.

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        • Michelle says:

          Welcome to astrology Flavio! That’s a fantastic way to view your girlfriend’s influence and a fantastic way to look at Saturn. Thank you for sharing your experience.

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      • billow says:

        I don’t know about personally handing it, but I know someone with saturn/uranus/mars conjunction in taurus and he made his living on the kiiling floor of meat packing plants. He was all about success and moving around leaving his family behind to run and catch up with him, or not.

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  2. Low Gale Haze says:

    It fits me perfectly, mainly when you’re talking about problems with self expression or being too hard on yourself. I had few problems with my dad, my mother was much more active in my life and she was kinda rigid, but I guess it all starts with me pushing myself too hard to surpass my own limitations or just doing nothing about anything because I know that I won’t be awesome. I need recognition, even if it’s just one person. I have a loose square with these two, but there’s also uranus conjunct my saturn near enaough to have the square with my sun. Both uranus and saturn are conjunct my ascendant, but they’re in house 12. Most of the effects are magnified by saturn being in sag and sun being in vir, since they’re related to perfectionism and breaking limits (wich may also be uranus’ influence).

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  3. MsFullroller says:

    As I was reading this I’m like, how in the heck did I miss that..DH has this aspect!! Sun in Cancer sextile Saturn in Virgo.

    “…Pruning back excess. “Tight” self-expression. Dried-out husk of a person. Depression. Dourness. Lack of vitality. Melancholy. Bleak outlook. Cutting back excess. Living an austere life. Self-deprivation. Scrooges. Making do with less. Having a very focused core self. Builders. Long-term planners. Understanding how events unfold over time. Realizing that it may take a long time to get what you want – but pushing ahead to get it anyway…Creative structure. Self-structuring. Creating schedules, routines and daily structures for your life. Finding yourself through experiences that require discipline and hard work. Pushing toward success. Living with restrictions. Thriving when you have restrictions placed upon you.”

    This was my life from early-mid 2001-2006. I’m guessing from progressed Sun in Taurus approaching/ sextiling natal Saturn in Pisces. It’s 3 degrees past natal Saturn now but I still feel a lot of this and other parts of the post.

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    • Michelle says:

      What kind of transits have you had over those years? Which houses has Saturn gone through?

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      • msfullroller says:

        When I got serious about buying a house T.Saturn and T. Jupiter were conjunct in the 9th hs, T. Mars conjuncting almost exact within minutes on my Taurus NN on the day of closing. Chiron was trine by 1 degree to natal 8th hs Mars, T. Mercury and Venus conjunct 8th hs Ceres. this was in June 2000.

        A year later some things happened that made me start to question what was going on as far as work and all that goes with it, so I set out to do what I could to pay off all my debt including my house. I had also began having a some health problems. I started cutting back my lifestyle little by little to get more more into my budget to put towards debt. Getting another job/additional job was out of the question because I was already working long hours in management due to expansion. Saturn had just crossed the MC into the 10th opposing T.Pluto/T.Mars retro in the 4th. T. Saturn conjunct natal Jupiter, I’m sure accounts for increases in pay which allowed me to continue paying down debt but also a major increase in responsibility.

        Saturn thru the 11th- I have no planets in the 11th or 5th houses except for POF in the 5th ruled by Saturn. 2005. DH and I got married married after a very long courtship. He had/has minor children from his previous marriage and due to this I still carried 95% of the household expenses while still aggressively paying down debt and building up savings. The children live with their mother. My mother has to retire early from work due to medical issues and comes to live with us late 2005-2006.

        Saturn thru the 12th- conjuncts my Leo Moon early 2007. Mom has moved out but a lot of family issues on my side and DH’s and repressed emotions start to come to the surface demanding to be looked at. A very depressing time while Saturn transits the 12th. The biggest highlight was when I went to the bank to completely pay off my last debt, the mortgage. On payoff day, T.Saturn is moving into a trine to my Sun with T. Sun almost exact sextile, T.Moon conjunct natal Moon, Mercury almost exactly sextile natal Ceres with T. Mars Square, T. Jupiter quincunx Sun, T. Pluto quincunx NN ,T. Chiron almost exact quincunx Ascendant and T. Neptune thru the 6th, almost exact semi-sextile POF. I stop working outside the home at the end of 2006. I made that choice for my health and sanity.

        Saturn thru the 1st- In early Nov 2008, DH was informed that the plant he was working at would be shut down. T.Saturn was conjunct natal Uranus/Pluto and opposing natal Mercury/Saturn/Chiron. T. Uranus was conjuncting what T. Saturn was on opposing and opposing was T. Saturn was conjuncting. Again, there were some blessings that came out of that, not with out some adjustments and surprises, but it could have been a whole lot worse. Which brings me to the present of Saturn thru the 2nd.

        Whew, long enough though i tried to hit on the top points. I’m sure I’ve forgotten something.

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  4. Zoa says:

    I’ve been waiting for this post for a while since this is one of my tighest and strongest aspects and probably the one I totally identify myself with. I can relate to everything above.
    Sun in Aquarius sextile Saturn in Capricorn, with a very tight orb ( 0º 41′)

    “Taking yourself too seriously”.. yes I take everything seriously, especially myself. My 8th house Sun adds even more depth to this. I can’t take things lightly. Such a heavy placement!

    “Life is a test”– definitively. I have always had to make great efforts to get things that others can have so easily. So much frustration…

    “Being really hard on yourself” check, especially with Saturn in the 6th house… I can be extremely hard on myself. I always try to do everything perfectly. I just can’t allow myself to do something I consider less than perfect.

    “Growing into yourself as you get older” This is totally me. I was never a child-like child. I never played or laughed or had fun like other kids. Ever since I can remember I’ve only known tasks and responsibilities. I experienced both my parents as Saturnine. A cold, harsh, rigid father, and a perfectionist mother who always expected a lot from me. They expected me to grow up fast and to pull my own weight. No time for childish or playful behaviors.

    Eventually I became a miniature adult, as a result I had a very unhappy and lonely childhood. I didn’t have any friends growing up. I became a loner, in part because my Cancer ascendant made me painfully shy and in part because I couldn’t stand other children. They felt immature and silly to me. Needless to say, I did get along with older people. As I’ve grown up I’ve learned to relax, to be more friendly, to allow myself to be more happy. I’ve experienced what they say about Saturn-things do get better in time.

    Finally, if I had to summarize myself with only a few words, it’d be exactly this
    “Realizing that it may take a long time to get what you want – but pushing ahead to get it anyway.”
    I have mentioned elsewhere, I have the Sun and Jupiter aspecting a triple conjunction of Mars, Saturn and Uranus. Which is a total b*tch. There are no easy rides with that aspect-I have drive, ambitions, enthusiasm and self-confidence but I’ve found nothing but limitations and obstacles and hardships and all things Saturn in my way. Yet I keep pushing because I don’t know anything else. I feel if I just keep going, someday I will have all the things I want from life.
    wow that was longer than expected. BTW I completely loved the second picture. Excellent as usual.

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    • Michelle says:

      thank you for sharing all of that Zoa. I love hearing personal experiences with astrology.

      Do you have other planets in Capricorn or the 10th house?

      I’m so glad you liked the second photo. I really liked it but I wasn’t sure it people would get it – but it seems like you guys always do! :D

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      • Zoa says:

        I think the second pic is the perfect metaphor for this aspect.

        Anyway, I have Saturn, Uranus and Neptune in Capricorn, and Jupiter and Venus in the 10th house.
        My Mars is in the last degrees of Sag so considering progressions I’ve practically live all my life with Mars in Capricorn as well.

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        • Michelle says:

          That’s very heavy Saturn/Capricorn/10th house influence.

          I don’t have any planets in Capricorn, not even an asteroid or other space gravel. This year my Solar Return has Capricorn rising with Pluto in Capricorn conjunct the ascendant. It will be a year to tap into that missing energy so I have much to learn from Capricorn types in my life :)

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  5. amoureuse08 says:

    i have square in sun cancer and libra saturn.. but why do i paint? write? used to join theater clubs?

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    • Michelle says:

      There is an artist and several musicians in the examples. Having a Sun/Saturn aspect doesn’t mean you can’t be a creative person, you just aren’t loose and carefree about it. There’s method, discipline and seriousness about it.

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      • amoureuse08 says:

        ur right.. im pretty serious about it.. especially with my self expression..

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  6. Joyrjw says:

    I have Sun Scorpio 5th square Saturn Leo 2nd

    That’s cool, I have a square like Salvador Dali,…I love his art.

    I guess it’s not so bad after all. :-)

    I can relate to wanting to be recognized for my work,but I won’t self promote because I don’t see myself as being good at anything…. “People who hold back and feel fearful or intimidated to express themselves.” This is a good line to explain how this aspect effects me I believe.

    I’m getting better at the self expression part I think, hopefully.

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    • Michelle says:

      I won’t self promote because I don’t see myself as being good at anything
      I think every creative person goes through periods like that, even if they already have the acknowledgement that they are successful.

      I watched a documentary on Foo Fighters last night. I’m not sure if you’re familiar with them but it’s a band that was started by Dave Grohl, the drummer of Nirvana. Anyway, Dave and the other band members talked a lot about the creative process, how they make the music, fears they had while touring, how they built an image…it was heartening to me to realize that even established artists don’t know what is going to happen. Nothing is assured. At certain times they each wondered if they were good enough. They realized that they needed to hone their craft and continue to develop as musicians. Being creative is ongoing, building confidence is ongoing, and the pursuit of success as you see it is also ongoing. It’s cliche, but you just have to take one step at a time.

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  7. Clarkastillman says:

    Sun Pi Sat Gem: either too hard on myself or too easy. Either way feel guilty. The four of us need to have a conference.

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    • Michelle says:

      Interesting Clark. Is Jupiter involved with the Sun or Saturn?

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  8. Happy Cappy says:

    Sun in capr. sextile saturn in pisc. here. I also have Saturn in aspect with Mercury (sextile), jupiter (trine), Uranus/Pluto (opp.)
    Saturn (and capr.) always get a bad rep. is it because most people don’t understand that without rules or structure there is no freedom. It is the other side of the same medal.

    Wesley Snipes sun opp. saturn in Aquarius = Run from the IRS :-)

    All the best for you Michelle thx for the post!

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    • Michelle says:

      Wesley Snipes sun opp. saturn in Aquarius = Run from the IRS :-)
      Exactly! I’m dying to know where his Saturn is. I wonder if it’s in the 8th house.

      Saturn (and capr.) always get a bad rep. is it because most people don’t understand that without rules or structure there is no freedom.
      I totally agree. If you don’t have some kind of discipline in your life, you’ll never accomplish what you want to accomplish.

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  9. tatiana.larina says:

    Every word you’ve written rings true for me, perhaps except for the “lack of humour”. Sun in Aries square Saturn in Cancer (both a part of the Cardinal Grand Cross).

    And I find it fascinating that both Williams sisters have Sun/Saturn aspects – probably because they have the same notorious father.

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    • Michelle says:

      And I find it fascinating that both Williams sisters have Sun/Saturn aspects – probably because they have the same notorious father.
      Ditto. I was happy to see the Sun/Saturn connection present for both sisters.

      I thought there was something interesting about the sisters being Gemini and Libra as well. Gemini is prone to “twinning” and Libra likes to partner up. Somehow this fits well for two sisters going into a sport where the competition is between two people. There aren’t many high profile professional sports that are one-on-one like that.

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  10. Michelle says:

    Saturn through the 12th is really tough. I just went through that transit a few years ago. During that period I had to totally let go and just accept that what was happening was happening.

    It’s interesting to me that you’ve also done your battle with debt since you also have several planets in the 8th house (including your Sun). Debt reduction is high priority for me right now. I’d like to pay it all off and never use a credit card again unless it was an emergency. My Dad did that in his life. I’m learning how important it is to live within my means. I’m going to get very old-fashioned about paying for things – if I can’t afford to pay for it in cash I’ll just have to save up.

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    • MsFullroller says:

      “…Debt reduction is high priority for me right now…”

      That is sweet heavenly music to my ears Sis!! Despite issues with my parents, that teaching is something I will always cherish them for. Did I go in the right way, heck no! If I had not been afraid to question society’s ways of handling money when I was younger, I would not have had any debt to pay off except the house. They (mostly Dad) taught me how to handle money so when I finally pulled my head outta my butt, I already had a foundation from which to build upon. They also were the type of folks who did not coddle financially or in any other way even though I am their only child. Once you reach 18, you are on your own, was/is their thinking. Shoot before the age of 18, what money I did have from working had to be budgeted. Asking for money because I spent it all before I got paid again was an absolute no go. This is why I can’t relate to grown folks who get help from their parents. That is a foreign world to me. Is it interesting since most of the descriptions of 8th house planets (maybe not Venus but definitely Sun and Moon) say that we don’t know how to handle money and always find ourselves in trouble because we are dependent on others’ resources?

      Yes Saturn thru the 12th is tough, double tough going over an already sensitive Moon. “..totally let go…”. yep, you hit it on the head! My edit to that reply might be sitting in moderation because it’s not showing up. What I added was another positive of that transit. Not realizing at the time when I found out that Saturn was transiting the 12th, I got aggressive in taking charge of my health. I forgot to mention in that edit, while T.Saturn was conjunct my Moon it opposed natal Venus in the 6th. Business at the place DH was working started to slow down so of course income went down. No problem,because we have no debt. This is why I encourage folks especially if you’ve got the means to do so, get out of debt. If means are limited, work on reducing it down as much as you can. Once you get out of debt, fight like hell to stay out!

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      • Michelle says:

        Saturn is transiting my 2nd house right now so my means are being limited for me. It’s hard for me to deny myself small luxuries in life (Moon in Leo square Jupiter in Taurus). I’m reading business and earning strategy books like mad. Before this transit I had never been interested in having a business of my own. I’ve also become a bit obsessed (did I mention that transiting Saturn is sitting on top of my Pluto) with how I can free up my time, life and mobility by earning my own money on my own terms. My parents do have good money habits, and I know I have that foundation so I feel confident that I will get my debt down to zero. Lately though I find myself think about “what happens next?” in any situation. Even when I get all of my debt down I won’t be financially independent until I’m no longer tied to a fixed wage/salary and work schedule.

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        • MsFullroller says:

          Interesting! Saturn’s about halfway thru my 2nd before it went retrograde. I’ve had thoughts in the past about starting a business long b4 Saturn’s transit. But after working for a small business, seeing and participating in the nuts and bolts of what has to be done to run a business, I’m not so sure I want to go there anymore. The owner had zero time to himself with most of his waking hours dictated by the business. He went from being able to take 2 week vacations to 3-4 days at the most, taking work home working till late in the eve, Saturdays, Sundays & holidays. There was not enough hours in the day to get it all done.

          Don’t know why but, when I edited my comment it said the comment would not appear until it had been approved by the moderator or something like that.

          The other thing that I has edited to add was the positive of Saturn thru the 10th and 11th. I was doing some cosmetic renovations on my home and did them all myself, discovering talents I did not know I had. Also it pushed me to really learn about debt/finance/business and all the other stuff that goes with it.

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          • Michelle says:

            I’m reading a book right now called The 4-Hour Work Week. It’s eye-opening. His whole idea is that you should be spending the least amount of time possible to earn the most money so you have the most free time to enjoy your life. Basically, you’re cutting out distractions, focusing on your strengths and giving your attention to what works.

            The crazy thing is that I feel like I have nothing to lose by trying these ideas out.

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      • billow says:

        Fresh air. I love it. I get so talked into whining about problems I didn’t have in my childhood. It seems there is a big ol campaign to do that instead of focusing on what I did get that sustained me through the years. So it’s always good to hear some strengths. Even if it was something like running through the woods in a loin cloth occasionally to escape the madness.

        I am much better with other people’s money than my own. Am working on that. It’s a case of the shoemaker’s shoes always got holes in them. When I worked as a seamstress, my hems were always pinned or taped.

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        • MsFullroller says:

          I think this is where I have to thank my t-squares and Sun/Mars & Ceres in Aries in the 8th. It makes me be my own safety net and in turn, trying to help others do the same for themselves. Then we can help each other.

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  11. MsFullroller says:

    Just had a lightbulb moment here this since I resonate with a lot of the post, not having this aspect natally. My progression does not seem to explain it completely because the parts I identify with were happening long before the progressed was in range of aspecting my natal Saturn. Are Sun/Saturn aspects similar to having a Capricorn 5th house?

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    • Atlast says:

      I was thinking about the same thing, the capricorn-saturn similarities. But I really think that is really different, first: caps are indeed self diciplined, but it has an extraordinary dark humor, what lacks in saturn. second, 5th house brings enthusiasm, leo characteristics to the personality and necessity to have fun, whether sign is it (in cap is a more diciplined way to have fun, like making hobbies into business), but saturn-sun aspect lacks all of it.

      #
      • MsFullroller says:

        Yes, Jupiter in Gemini in the 10th square Saturn in Pisces in the 7th. Saturn aspects a lot in my chart.

        Saturn conjunct Mercury Rx, Chiron, Pallas and (True Lilith?)
        Saturn opposition Uranus/Pluto in Virgo conjunct in the 1st house.
        Saturn quincunx 12th house Leo Moon
        Saturn semi-sextile 6th house Aquarius Venus
        Saturn trine 3rd house Neptune in Scorpio
        Saturn sextile 5th house Capricorn POF
        Saturn quintile Gemini MC

        #
  12. Leah-nine says:

    Your descriptions of aspects are always so on-point!

    #
    • Michelle says:

      Thanks :)

      #
  13. Joswan says:

    Oh! How appropriate you put a bonsai tree inside an encapsuled environment like in the last picture! I FREAKIN love terrarium! Eversince that represents this article, I would decide to make more in my home :)
    The attitude of Sun square Saturn not only reflect in my characteristic but also applies to my hobbies such as aquarium, terrarium and many “limited” miniatures edition :) Even more, when I success later, I want to live in 90 square feet apartment with a loft bed with my face that only 30 cm away from the ceiling, freakin love enclosed space!!! IF I have extra unused space in my cell, that means my mission FAILED! D:

    #
      • Joswan says:

        Cool beans, you gave me idea! :) To make it more compact, I will make mine has hollow deck, so I can cook underneath my bed :)
        <3 compact cubicles!! :)

        #
        • Michelle says:

          I’m not going to advocate cooking under your bed: recipe for disaster!

          #
      • LB says:

        My Saturn in the 4th (which is sextile Venus, ruler of and conjunct my Sun) also likes to live small, although my idea of small is still considerably bigger than Joswan’s (yay, Joswan!) I’m not at all comfortable living in larger environments – I always end up feeling like I’m collecting stuff just to fill space. All that “stuff” starts to weigh me down.

        Currently my progressed Saturn is conjunct progressed Venus (ruler of my natal 2nd, Sun, and Venus), and we may have to downsize once again.

        This was another good post with lots of good comments.

        #
        • Michelle says:

          I grew up in a very small house. I never fully realized how small it was until I started watching all these shows with people buying 2000-3000 square foot homes. I think small space living brings people closer together. It also prevents you from accumulating junk. Though, it can be a bit claustrophobic.

          #
        • Christine says:

          Strange – I have the same aspect (Saturn in the 4th sextile Venus) and I would hate to live in a small house (again). I think it’s worthy to mention that my Uranus is conjunct the 4th house (loosely, I think, and from the 3rd house) and I have my NN in Aquarius there. I’ve never wanted a huge home, but it’s important to me that every room doesn’t feel jampacked with junk. It’s also important that each individual room has a sense of zen or “balance” inside.

          My boyfriend, who has Sun conjunct Saturn in Libra (and a Chiron in Taurus in the 2nd) values a traveler’s lifestyle, where he can abandon all his things and just… leave (Moon in Sag conj Neptune, maybe?). However, he’s very hesitant to throw things away, even though he would like to. With Scorpio ruling the 2nd (and Pluto kind of there), I don’t have a problem heartlessly throwing things I don’t need away. Out of sight, out of mind! The physical junk I have just ends up cluttering my mind!

          #
          • LB says:

            “I’ve never wanted a huge home, but it’s important to me that every room doesn’t feel jampacked with junk. It’s also important that each individual room has a sense of zen or “balance” inside.”

            Hi Christine – I have to admit, one of the few disadvantages of living small is that there’s a thin line between homey and cluttered. I try to walk that line very carefully, but every once in a while when things start to accumulate, I get nervous and have to purge – I like the one-thing-in, one-thing-out rule. I’m a Libra, so the sense of balance (as well as aesthetics) you mention is important to me also. On the plus side, I’m a natural organizer, so even my drawers and closets look neat and beautiful.

            It’s funny about your boyfriend’s 2nd house and how he values a “traveler’s lifestyle”. I have a jam-packed 2nd house, with my Libra/Scorpio stellium placed there (including Neptune), and being able to pack up and leave is always in the back of my mind. When we downsized, I tried to keep only the things I truly valued or that were useful. The rest I donated to charity.

            I can see how with your NN in Aquarius placed in the 4th, you’d absolutely need a sense of space and freedom. My Moon, Vertex and Chiron are all in Aquarius, so I get that!

            #
      • MsFullroller says:

        I love small space living too! Though like LB, I’m not sure I could go as small as Joswan but I don’t really like large spaces. Too much to clean up and too expensive to maintain!

        I still don’t see how that is reflected in my chart. About 70% of my 4th is in Sag with the remainder in Capricorn. Maybe my Aries Sun, Virgo Ascendant, Aquarius Venus whose ruler is conjunct the Ascendant both aspected by Saturn accounts for this?

        #
        • LB says:

          This is just a thought, but maybe Sag ruling the 4th tends to make us value freedom over stuff. I’d much rather have a small space with a big view – someplace easy to clean equals more free time, and is also much easier to pack up and go if need be. Where’s your Jupiter, MsFullroller? Any aspects to Saturn?

          I’ll be curious what Michelle has to say. I’m no Astrologer. :)

          #
          • MsFullroller says:

            Valuing freedom, heck yes!! That’s what I love about my home. I lovingly refer to it as a stand alone 2 bedroom apartment with it’s own roof at 836 sq ft. It’s smaller than most 2 bedroom apartments around here and just slightly bigger than a one bedroom. lol If I had bought something bigger, I would not have had the opportunity to give myself the bit of freedom that I have. It has a huge yard so I can just go outside for a more expansive feeling. You’ve just pointed out what T. Saturn thru the 2nd maybe trying to point out to me…value your freedom and don’t let anyone change that for their benefit!!

            Jupiter is in the 10th at the apex of a t-square, Saturn on one end, Uranus/Pluto on the other end. I read I think in Liz Greene’s book on Saturn that T. Saturn is a liberator. Now that I think about it, I’ve felt that as it’s traveled thru. Saturn’s a pretty good guy if ya work with him. lol

            #
            • Michelle says:

              Saturn’s a pretty good guy if ya work with him. lol
              Yes, I think so. Saturn is kind of like a harsh parent, he may seem mean but he just wants what’s best for you.

              #
            • billow says:

              “if you work with him” . . . was hard to key that energy since it is natally in Scorpio. The postings here helped to define. My natal venus even got a kick. Grand water trine seems to make sense now. : ]

              #
          • Michelle says:

            maybe Sag ruling the 4th tends to make us value freedom over stuff
            In living situations I value looseness and relaxation. When I go home I want to be totally carefree. I want to be able to be completely myself without any rules or regulations.

            To a certain extent I also want to be free from the burden of owning my own home. I’d rather have opportunities to travel.

            #
            • Leah-Nine says:

              I feel the same way about the home situation but I always worry that I’ll have nowhere to keep the few things that I really value, or that if I won’t be able to host friends. It’s kind of a conundrum: Freedom from a house but also freedom with a house… Do you ever feel like this with your Leo Moon?

              #
              • Michelle says:

                Hm…I haven’t been feeling like this lately.

                #
        • Michelle says:

          Maintenance – yuck! I hate having to spend more time than is absolutely necessary cleaning. The shortest path from dirty to clean is where it’s at, though I am thorough.

          I still don’t see how that is reflected in my chart
          Hm… me neither. I have Neptune in Sag in the 4th – not especially representative of having grown up in a small house. I did move a lot though.

          I wonder if close Mercury/Saturn aspects have something to do with it.

          #
          • MsFullroller says:

            Ooo I hear ya on the cleaning and add cooking to the list as well. I did not mind it so much a few years ago but shoot, not anymore.

            Sounds good to me since Mercury does rule the immediate neighborhood and Saturn restricts somewhat…at least that’s how I understand it. Can’t get anymore immediate than your abode. My train of thought especially with you and I being Aries Suns, Aries are pretty minimalist when it comes to most domestic things. Virgo risings likes things efficient and Sag breathes freedom. I’ll tell anybody, June Cleaver, I am NOT.

            #
            • Michelle says:

              I actually do like cooking, and I’m a decent home cook. I’ve thought about why that is and for a while I thought it was because of Mars in Cancer, but now I think it’s the influence of Jupiter in Taurus. Jupiter in Taurus is the only placement I share with my Dad and he also loves cooking.

              I’m not June Cleaver either!

              #
              • MsFullroller says:

                Oh, I can “burn” no doubt, it’s just not something that I particularly like to do. I’d rather be doing something else. Maybe I’m feeling the effects of progressed Moon & Venus in Aries conjunct natal Juno and the progressed Sun in the last 5 degrees of Taurus conjunct NN. When progressed Venus & Moon was in Pisces, I actually started enjoying cooking and would frequently make desserts too. I’m sooo over that now it ain’t even funny. If it were not so expensive and unhealthy to eat out everyday, I would.

                #
  14. Les says:

    I have Sun in Virgo square Saturn in Sag, which is on my 5th house cusp. It does get better with age – you have to grow into Sun/Saturn to get the benefit. I’m still not one for fun and games! I do have Uranus (in Leo conj my Ascendant/Moon) trine my Saturn, which adds some inspiration and creative spark that my Saturn can put into form.

    #
    • Michelle says:

      My mom has Saturn in Sagittarius in the 5th house (using Placidus). Having kids forced her to mature.

      #
  15. Aycelina says:

    Being your own authority. Making your own rules. Creative structure. Self-structuring.
    Sun sextile Saturn…

    #
  16. Aycelina says:

    Being your own authority. Making your own rules. Creative structure. Self-structuring.
    Sun Sextile Saturn…
    besides
    it is quitely true
    also
    Testing yourself. Being your own taskmaster. Feeling that other people are always testing you. Life is a test. Feeling that other people impose restrictions on your personal freedom.

    #
  17. Michelle says:

    Did I just write that?
    Lol!

    #
  18. Robin Joy Dore says:

    I have to ask…. What would cause a person to like having lots of space and room to move as opposed to small space living?

    #
    • Michelle says:

      I’ve been wondering about it. I’m thinking perhaps even Moon/Saturn would fit. Curiously, I don’t think the need for freedom in mobility is the same as needing a large house. I seem to do okay in small spaces but my boyfriend has a hard time and feels like he can’t breathe. He has Sun conjunct Uranus in the 9th house.

      #
      • MsFullroller says:

        How about some combination of Venus/ Jupiter/ Moon aspects with a easy Saturn too, with Taurus/Libra/Cancer/Sag/Pisces 4th house?

        “..I don’t think the need for freedom in mobility is the same as needing a large house…”

        My thoughts exactly! I can see why your boyfriend would have a hard time with small spaces. Sun conjunct Uranus does not like to be confined at all and I would think being placed in the 9th ups the ante. I’m curious to know, what’s would be too small for him?

        #
        • Michelle says:

          He doesn’t like houses or apartments with normal ceiling heights. He can deal with small square footage but he still wants a raised ceiling. Every apartment we’ve lived in has had huge ceiling heights – funny, I didn’t realize that till just this minute!

          #
      • Robin Joy Dore says:

        Hmmm, I have Moon sextile Uranus, maybe in my case that’s it. I don’t have any Moon/Saturn contacts or anything in my 9th house, unless you look at my MC in Equal house,but I don’t think that counts. :-)
        My husband has Sun/Uranus aspect too,but in opposition and for some reason he doesn’t mind being in overly cluttered/small spaces. (???) He’s a pack rat. ^~^
        He doesn’t have any major Moon/Saturn aspects either.
        Veeeery Interestiiiinnng. =-)

        #
        • Robin Joy Dore says:

          By the thank you, for responding and answering something that’s kind of off subject. :-)

          #
          • Michelle says:

            :)

            #
        • Michelle says:

          My boyfriend is also a packrat and he constantly clutters the spaces he’s in. Every time I clear a surface he piles something on top of it.

          #
          • Robin Joy Dore says:

            Oh wow! That’s really funny… funny interesting I mean. That’s what happens with us too. I try to organize(though I’m not the most organized person either, ugh) and he makes a mess again. Who knows, maybe the Sun/Uranus aspects make people want to create chaos around them ??? :-) but the chaos is really order for them, maybe. That’s really interesting to know though.

            #
            • Robin Joy Dore says:

              I mean absolutely no offense to anyone who has Sun/Uranus aspects. If I do offend I sincerely apologize.

              #
            • Michelle says:

              I think it may be a rebellion against having to do things a certain way. Sun/Uranus people don’t seem to be messy by default. I know someone else with Sun conjunct Uranus and she doesn’t create chaos through messiness – though she has a habit of rearranging everyone’s stuff so they can’t find it, creating chaos for everyone else.

              Sun/Uranus people seem mostly concerned with maintaining their autonomy and not letting anyone tell them what to do. They are extremely independent and will get contrary if you try to force them to do anything they don’t want to (or feel that you are trying to control them).

              #
              • Robin Joy Dore says:

                I do believe I agree with you. :-) I can see what you’re talking about.

                My husband can be very rebellious, :-D and contrary, whatevers popular he wants to do the opposite. :-D To add to the rebellious part of him he’s triple fire…..
                I just honestly let him know that I’m not trying to control him or make him conform and that what I’m trying to do is for a GOOD reason and many times he’ll try to listen. Many times I find it funny,but other times when change is necessary it can frustrating…but what can you do? If we all had the same mindset the world would be a boring place…. In my opinion. ^_^

                #
  19. gibsonia says:

    The Bonsai Tree is spot on to visually describe this aspect. The way I experience the trine (between sun gemini in the eighth and libra in the twelfth) is to want to eliminate waste and ‘spring clean’ my mind and life over time. For the last few years I’ve been in this phase of extreme austerity, which has resulted partly from lack of opportunity, and partly from me taking a kind of a uncompromisingly ‘under the radar’ course in life. I just got married, and I’m predictably having issues with feeling lack of independence (I’m only semi employed), so I’ve developed this complex about what the beautiful life means, and how it can be enjoyed in the most limited circumstances, and how my freedom (the twelfth house there) from these prison-like situations I get into, where I’m uneasily dependant on other people’s resources can actually be bought, with hard work, and literally, financially, by squirrelling away money constantly. I have these fantasies about building up a nest egg and leaving everyone I know for a year to be by myself. Hard graft and peace in nature and in solitude is becoming more and more important for me. I have a mad sun mars conjunct in Gemini (also mercury in gemini), so I’m a wordy, creative person, with nervous energy. I also have moon in libra trine mercury and venus in leo trine uranus in sagittarius. I have my fingers in so many pies and none of them are even close to being done, however as I get older I think that maybe sometime they will be, if I can rely on my own resources and go to bed satisfied with what I’ve done every day. Another aspect of this twelfth house eighth house sun/saturn thingy is that I really like second hand clothes, and antiques, as there’s a certain satisfaction for me in unearthing things that are still useful, practical and beautiful, using them and knowing that they won’t be wasted. I often wrap presents in lovely paper that was used for something else. it’s not out of stinginess, it just sort of feels good somehow. I’m pretty OK with passing on things when I’m done with them, though not before. I’m scorpio rising and have a lot of connections between the eigth house and second house too.

    #
    • Michelle says:

      I can relate to much of what you wrote here with my own Sun in the 8th house, Moon in the 12th and Pluto in the 2nd.

      It’s a complicated thing having a 2nd/8th house polarity because there is a drive to be self-sufficient yet circumstances frequently dictate being reliant on other people.

      Thank you for reading Gibsonia.

      #
      • MsFullroller says:

        Even though my 2nd house is empty, I definitely relate to what you and Gibsonia wrote. Thanks for shedding a bit more light on the 2nd/8th house polarity.

        #
  20. Monkj says:

    Thanks Michelle. Your blog is great. It reads stylish as well as insightful – not in a superficial way, but in a way that allows you to wrap your head around things in a very visual manner. People think that astrology is vague, but it’s not a quotient, it’s a picture; it’s not an answer, it’s a portrait. You’re doing a really great job of making these concepts visceral and real. Visceral – an 8th house kind of word! Definitely a tough polarity for me, as the 8th and 2nd oppositions are battling out against the 12th and 8th trines. Clearly it’s much easier for me to process things in isolation than with other people. I am very self aware, but it doesn’t make it any easier to be myself around other people. I have difficulty sharing my creative work, particularly music (neptune in the 2nd) with other people. Got my north node in gemini in the 8th too. I sometimes despair that I’m meant for a martyred, humbled, modest kind of life, rather than the strong independent one I’d like to lead. Other people break me down. So far at least it’s been in what you would say positive ‘moral’ ways, but not positive as regards my wellbeing, mental or physical.

    #
    • LB says:

      Like Michelle, I also relate to much of what you’ve shared.  My 2nd/8th house oppositions always present challenges in terms of learning to accept my areas of dependence (or is it interdependence?) while still developing a strong sense of self-worth and contribution.  How do I share my talents/resources while encouraging others to develop their own talents/resources?  I’m gradually coming to the realization that our different gifts are part of what make healthy relationships possible.  What one lacks, the other provides.  My weaknesses are balanced by the other’s strengths and vice versa – not the same as dysfunctional co-dependency at all.  Such a simple concept but so hard for me to accept!  And with Neptune on the cusp of the 2nd/3rd, I can sometimes be very shy creatively.  There are certain talents I’ve always been afraid to give a full voice to – one of my goals is to move beyond those fears before I die!  Neptune’s ruler is placed in my 12th, so I process and am most inspired during periods of isolation.  

      With two outer planets placed in the 12th, I understood what you said about leading a “humbled, modest kind of life”, albeit a life that’s rich in terms of having developed a meaningful value system (i.e., “moral ways”).  Relationships always “break me down” and very few have maintained enough balance to survive – I’m grateful for those, even when I struggle in them.  My 8th house South Node in Aries is opposite Venus in Libra in the 2nd and trines 12th house Uranus – total independence is an illusion for me.  I’m not an island, even if I feel like it sometimes.

      #
      • Michelle says:

        “Interdependence” is a much better word for it than dependence.

        total independence is an illusion for me.  I’m not an island, even if I feel like it sometimes.
        That’s exactly what I’ve come to understand too. With 3 planets in Aries (plus Chiron and BML) and the Moon conjunct Saturn, it is awfully tempting to try to be an island – but it just doesn’t work. 

        Plus, with a 2nd house/8th house polarity, part of the life experience is being deeply involved in giving and receiving. And, it has to be both ways – giving and receiving – not one or the other.

        #
        • LB says:

          “Plus, with a 2nd house/8th house polarity, part of the life experience
          is being deeply involved in giving and receiving. And, it has to be both
          ways – giving and receiving – not one or the other.”

          That’s it exactly, Michelle!  Yet ironically, the giving and receiving doesn’t always take place at the same time – there are inevitable cycles in life that need to be honored (Ceres in the 2nd exactly opposite Eris/Osculating Lilith in the 8th).  I could never understand why 2nd house descriptions seemed so limiting to me – that is until I began to understand the dynamic between my 2nd and 8th house oppositions.  My BM Lilith (in Aries) is there as well, but traditional astrology ignored most of my 8th house placements because they didn’t include major planets.

          #
          • Michelle says:

            2nd house descriptions always seem limiting to me. I’m a bit obsessed with the 2nd house since I have Pluto there. I want to get all the way down into what it means.

            #
            • MsFullroller says:

              Thank you both for this side discussion on the 2nd/8th house. My understanding of it based on most interpretations I have received have left me confused, especially since I don’t have any asteroids or planets in my Libra 2H. The Aries 8H has my Sun/Juno/Mars conjunction with Eris, Ceres, Karma  and couple of other goddess asteroids. What I’ve found out about (the asteroids) have been very helpful and have filled in some gaps that I did not get from just the major planets. But that Aries energy has consistently demonstrated that I’m basically on my own or maybe I should say nothing falls in my lap.  However, these exchanges and your blog, I think fits the others resources category for which I’m truly grateful to have and to some degree have “fallen in my lap”.   

              ‘2nd house descriptions always seem limiting to me. I’m a bit obsessed
              with the 2nd house since I have Pluto there. I want to get all the way
              down into what it means.”

              My progressed chart has the 2nd house in Scorpio so I definitely relate even with Neptune conjunct the SN, hence the research I’ve been doing.  8th house descriptions are limiting to me as well.

              #
              • Michelle says:

                8th house descriptions are limiting to me as well.
                I think so too. Some people chime in with “Well, it’s sex, death and taxes!” as if that explained everything. 

                Some of what I think about the 8th house is difficult to put into words. Also, it really is taboo which makes it doubly difficult to talk about.

                #
              • LB says:

                After all these years MsFullroller, I finally THINK (???HOPE???) I might be starting to get a better handle on the 2nd and 8th – my small mind has begun to scratch the surface anyway.  But like all three of us have mentioned, most descriptions have seemed limited, and in my case, even contradictory when compared to my actual experiences (and soul’s yearnings).    Maybe it’s partly because this particular axis encourages transformation, so the esoteric meanings are just as likely to apply as the mundane, depending on where the person is at.  There are various layers to move through and we can get stuck at any one of them. 

                For instance, using some of the descriptions I found in an online article written by Candy Hillenbrand, some of the esoteric meanings of the 2nd house would include “spiritual values” and “use of life’s energies”.  Now that I relate to!  2nd/8th house descriptions that may have fit me 20-30 years ago no longer do, although I still cling to some of the remnants.  I also think having Scorpio planets (or Pluto) in the 2nd changes things up a bit in terms of defining what it is that we value.  I have another theory too, but I won’t bore you guys with it – lol!

                #
    • Michelle says:

      “Visceral” is my favorite 8th house word.

      Clearly it’s much easier for me to process things in isolation than with other people. 
      Yes, me too.

      Other people break me down
      Interesting. There is too much sensitivity to subtle influences when the water houses are emphasized. It’s rarely anything overt or obvious that wears away at you. And, with the 12th house, there’s the need to retreat to be able to come back and take more. 

      #
  21. Michelle says:

    Please, bore me with your other theory ;)

    #
    • LB says:

      Uh-oh, I was afraid you’d be polite and say that. :)  If you start rolling your eyes and yawning as
      you read my comment, don’t say I didn’t warn you!  It’s not so much an original theory, as it is
      an elaboration. 

       

      Basically it has to do with the planet Vulcan (h55), which can
      never be more than 8 degrees away from our Sun. 
      According to what I’ve read, its effects are only felt by those seeking
      to move beyond the limits of personality/ego, which is why it’s only used in
      esoteric astrology.  So following this
      line of reasoning, if you or I (or MsFullroller) happen to be on a more
      spiritual path, and if we also happen – by virtue of our Sun being placed in
      either the 2nd or 8th house – to have Vulcan placed
      there, we may stop identifying with the more traditional house descriptions,
      especially as Vulcan begins its process of transformation.  From what I’ve read, this might also happen
      with any natal planet in aspect to Vulcan.

      Vulcan’s nullifying effects would be felt in whatever house it’s placed in.  But since Vulcan is placed in my 2nd, exactly conjunct my Venus – ruler of my 2nd/9th – and is less than 2 degrees away from my North Node, I think its presence may help explain why some 2nd house meanings don’t work as well for me anymore.

      I know esoteric astrology isn’t for everyone, but some of it is pretty interesting.

      #
      • LB says:

        Me thinks I have to stop copying and pasting comments – too many random spaces make my comments hard to read.  Sorry!

        #
      • MsFullroller says:

        Michelle beat me to it! Bore some more if you’d like! ;-)

        I looked up Vulcan and it’s at 4 Aries, placing in front of my 11 Aries Sun. The only other aspect it makes is a sextile to the IC/MC axis.  Going with Vulcan nullifying  the effects of it house placement, yeah I totally see that!

         Very interesting indeed.

        #
        • Michelle says:

          My Vulcan is closely opposite your Sun.

          #
          • MsFullroller says:

            Yep, real close by 5 minutes and Medea (#212) by 1 deg 7’!

            I just remembered that Vulcan also is square my 5 Cancer 10′ Vesta in the 10th, sextile 5 Aquarius 54′ Hecate (#100) in the 6th and tightly sextile 4 Gemini 24′ Europa (#52) in the 9th which is conjunct my MC at 5 Gemini 33′. Vulcan sits right between other goddess asteroids, 0 Aries 55′ Ariadne (#43), and 8 Aries 36′ Mnemosyne(#57).  This is conjunction is at the apex of a t-square with Vesta opposing 7 Capricorn 15′ Proserpina(#26) in the 4th.  lastly a wide semi-sextile to I’m not sure which Lilith this is, (it’s the one that astro.com always lists on the chart at 0 Pisces 01′.

            Before knowing this, I thought I had nothing in the early degrees besides that Lilith but I always feel the transits in the early degrees. I see why now!

            #
            • LB says:

              MsFullroller, your Hecate is conjunct (within a degree) my Moon/Kaali.  My Hecate (which is conjunct my Ascendant and various other asteroids) is 11 Virgo 25 – any connection to your chart?

              #
              • MsFullroller says:

                Yep! Your Hecate would be conjunct my Ascendant,  Uranus/Pluto conjunction by 5 degrees, tightly quincunx my Sun and a bit looser to the Medea/Juno conjunction.

                #
                • LB says:

                  Synastry is amazing. :)

                  #
            • Michelle says:

              I’m not sure which Lilith you mean, check out my Lilith post – it gives all the numbers for Lilith: http://astrofix.net/2010/07/01/how-to-find-all-four-liliths-in-your-birth-chart/

              #
              • MsFullroller says:

                It’s the one that you can just highlight in the “Additional Objects: section.  That one is at 0 Pisces in my chart. The Liliths listed in your post are at different placements with the closest one to that is h21 shown as Lilith (i) on astro.com @ 26 Aqu 7′.  Hmm, I just realized Black Moon Lilith is square Algol.

                #
                • Michelle says:

                  The one that you highlights in the additional objects box should match the Mean Lilith position.

                  #
      • Michelle says:

        I’m not bored, I’m intrigued.

        For anyone reading, go to astro.com, free horoscopes, extended chart selection and enter H55 into the empty box on the bottom left corner of the scree to find out where your Vulcan is.

        Mine is 11 Aries 36′ in the 8th house making a t-square with Pluto at 10 Libra 06′ in the 2nd house and Mars at 10 Cancer 00′ in the 11th house. Now my obsession is better explained. Plus, I haven’t been content with 11th house descriptions either. 

        #
        • LB says:

          Thanks Michelle and MsFullroller, for humoring me by being open-minded.  I can’t remember where I read it, but I think I saw where Vulcan isn’t able to affect the Sun or Mercury, although the sign it’s placed in is important. 

          But what do I know – I’m not an astrologer.  I only play one on astrology blogs (ha ha ha).

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          • Michelle says:

            I’m not an astrologer.  I only play one on astrology blogs
            Lol :D

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  22. Davida says:

    “Realizing that it may take a long time to get what you want – but pushing ahead to get it anyway. ”
    Ah, this is a new phase in my life. The realization that things aren’t going to be easy for me like it is for some people. Cheers to working hard.

    Gemini 9th H Sun opp. Scorpio 2nd H Saturn.

    I thrive with time restrictions, and always work better under pressure (procrastination does wonders for me). I keep who I really am under wraps. Most people see me as the lovely Libra ASC (nice, bubbly, attractive, a bit ditzy (airhead)), until they really get to know me. Once I am found out, I am described as basically everything  above, with a strong Scorpio undertone. Dark, intelligent, “old soul”, yadda, yadda.

    I think I get off on acting stupid. The key word here is acting. I’m not sure why. It’s my facade, my mask.

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  23. Voyages says:

    The people I look up in life all have Sun/Saturn aspects…the people who are really “models” for me.

    Two of my best friends have there Sun in late Pisces squaring Saturn in early Cappy.

    Another best friend has: Sun in Cancer trining Saturn in Scorpio

    i, myself have Sun in Virgo squaring Saturn in Sag.

    i think that Oprah Winfrey models this Sun/Saturn energy well, not without relevant struggle though. we are the people who really “Get real” with our creative energy. Or at least need to.

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  24. Blanche says:

    I have Saturn in Aries in the 4th house opposing my Libra 10th house Sun and squaring Capricorn ascendant. I had very strict childhood and teenage years. I constantly clashed (still do) with my mother. She always felt I was an attention seeker and did not like me doing anything socially. Alot was also expected of me academically and my father and her had tremendous fights (Aries in 4th perhaps?). Not too happy all up.

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  25. Sveta from Russia says:

    Hello.
    I have saturn (in scorpio at 1st house) square sun (in leo at 10th house). And now my saturn have returned. I am dying…

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    • AstroFix says:

      I hope you don’t mean that literally, Sveta. Saturn return can be tough!

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  26. Dancer says:

    I have a tight Sun-Sat square natally. Where do I begin? Zoa’s post was freakishly like a description of my own life. Extremely harsh father, mother wasn’t much better. Forced to grow up very quickly, had heavy responsibilities as a child, started working as a child, didn’t have a real childhood, always overly serious, life was a constant struggle, zero self-esteem, yada yada, yada… also depression has followed me throughout my life. I’m extremely ambitious, a perfectionist and hard on myself and it took me a long time to finally learn to value myself and my skills. I’m actually very talented and smart (not bragging, just sayin’..) but in spite of this, I have yet to be “rewarded” financially for my skills. Recognition and financial rewards are high on my list of priorities. I’m now in my 50s and still waiting for that to happen. I’ve always been a hard worker (workaholic) but the last couple of years it took a toll on me healthwise and I’ve been forced to cut back. Despite all that work, I’ve still yet to see $$$. Saturn has tested me over and over and over again… it’s relentless. I currently have T. Saturn sxt natal Ven and natal Sat (I have natal Ven trine Sat) so I’m hoping for a little respite before it conj’s my Moon (and Ven/Mar) in a year!

    As for men in my life… I seem to attract a lot of men with whom I have strong Saturn aspects in synastry. I’m currently attracted to a guy who has a Sun-Sat square natally and we have a Sat-Moon conj (both ways) in our synastry. In the Composite, we have a tight Sun-Moon-Sat conj in 7thH! LOL….

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