Saturn/Neptune Aspects
Marilyn Monroe: Saturn in Scorpio square Neptune in Leo
Turning dreams into reality. The realities of fantasy. Practical dreamers. Practical fantasies. Taking concrete steps to realize your dreams. Envisioning your ideal world and taking the steps to create that world. Dissolving reality. Teaching how to dream. Dream instructors. Dream makers. Dreaming your life. Making it up as you go along. Pretending. Creating illusions in plain sight. The fantasy, in plain sight. What is real and what is an illusion? Real life is an illusion. Reality is an illusion. Reality is malleable. Reality is what you make it. Building your ideal life. “Reality” TV. Blurring the lines between what is real and what is fake. Acting your way through life. Glamorizing your reality. Trying to make your life seem more magical than it really is.
Otherworldly. Spiritual authority. Spiritual disciplines. Spiritual teachers. Dance, art and music teachers. Skilled musicians. Matter of fact about spirituality. The practical application of a spiritual life. The practical application of the dreaming life. Making practical use of dance, music or other artistic skills. Pragmatic fantasies. Using artistic skills in business. Working hard to develop your artistic skills. Working hard to develop your spiritual and psychic aptitude. Real life psychics. Materialism versus spirituality. Inability to reconcile spiritual longings with practical concerns. Your ideal fantasy life is at odds with your real life. Duties and responsibilities prevent you from fully taking off into flights of fancy. You feel prevented from pursuing dreams. You feel that you aren’t “allowed” to live your ideal life. Something prevents you from letting go. Pessimism and skepticism can prevent you from realizing your dreams. Reality creeps into every fantasy. Fantasy creeps into reality. Everyday life takes on a fantastic narrative. Adding glamor to real life. Wanting a storybook life. Fairy tales with life lessons.
The slippery slope of success. Hiding from authority. Undermining authority. Weakening established structures. Lack of ambition. Weak boundaries. Lack of boundaries. Deceptive authorities. Authority in a fog. Seeking to escape responsibility. Slipping through the cracks. Escaping the real world. Going to California to live out your dream of being an actor. Escaping to L.A. Fleeing from authorities. Attempting to get away with it. Dropping out. Feelings of futility. Why bother? Pathetic. Listless. Feeling that other people put their responsibilities on you. Taking on too many duties out of an inability to set appropriate boundaries. Feeling responsible for the weak, ill and people who are down on their luck. Empathy for those dealing with depression. Having a hard time coping with life. Having compassion for those who also have a hard time coping with life. Compassionate authority. Relinquishing authority. Giving up. Inability to get your act together.
Victims of authority. Being victimized by your father. Dad acts like a victim. Having a weak father. Dad disappeared. Dad was a drunk. Wanting to escape from your father. Idealizing Dad. Dad was an actor. Con men. Victims of “the system.” Tragic figures. Sad music. Depressing fantasies. Self-pity and depression mixed together. Victim mentality and pessimism mixed together. Confusion and rigidity mixed together. Overly sensitive to harsh reality. Inability to take control of your own life. Getting involved with shady men. Seriously shady dealings. Watching the life you have built melt beneath your feet. Getting swept up in someone’s else’s attempts to structure your life. Looking for someone to give structure to your life. Looking for someone to help you get your feet on the ground. Floating. Ungrounded. Transient. Ephemeral. Free form. Slurry. Fear of the unknown. Afraid of dissolving into nothingness. Master of Illusion.
Morrissey of The Smiths has Saturn 6 Capricorn 04′ Rx sextile Neptune 4 Scorpio 55′ Rx
I am of the 1953 conjunction and I totally love the way I manifest things artistically Sometimes I have to push thru tough times by “just keeping the faith” that it will work out. So far so good..
What kind of art are you involved in Maria? Thank you for stopping by.
I have Saturn and Neptune in mutual reception, and they also make a very tight semi-square.
This is all so true for me. When I dream, everything seems real, concrete. Saturn takes my Pisces side to other levels, so yes, the feeling of being a victim of the world, bound to suffer and serve as a sacrifice also comes in. It’s weird.
Do you do any actual dream work Iago, like keeping track of repetitive themes?
No, I’ve never kept track of anything. I often do notice recurrent themes, and even recurrent dreams. Only when I dream something too emotionally strong I write it down or tell it to a friend.
I don’t know what to do with my dreams. Some of them seem very significant, but I can’t really say.
@lefeufollet:disqus
I don’t know what to do with my dreams
You can use them to get in touch with your inner landscape – the people, terrain, things and common interactions that happen there.
hmm, my generation has neptune in capricorn…. anyways nobody has slipped through the cracks more than me, i walk in rooms and no one notices, never end up having to produce projects(my turn never comes) i have slipped through about more work than anyone else i know in my school, but this may all be me just being a pisces, and every time im too lazy to do work it ends up the works due date gets pushed backed or somehow i never have to produce it, how about you add psychically work, because im still a hard worker, just i can sense when i dont have to do something
i can sense when i dont have to do something
That’s a handy sense! Pisces does like being able to get out of things.
sure do, and i get my kicks out of when people dont notice i was there or realize i am there or cant fully grasp me, not that i sneak around on purpose, just i enjoy going unnoticed, but i sure love my invisibility/ disappearing act, i could have far worse qualities though
“Duties and responsibilities prevent you from fully taking off into
flights of fancy. You feel prevented from pursuing dreams. You feel that
you aren’t “allowed” to live your ideal life.”
While I relate to some of the positive descriptions, I guess my semisquare makes it easier to identify with the negatives. Practical limitations combined with an awareness of my own shortcomings (Saturn in the 4th) have often required me to adjust my ideals or even give up on certain dreams. I do far better when my expectations are kept in check and I don’t get too attached to outcomes – other astrological placements contribute to this feeling.
Sometimes, if a lot of challenging external stuff is going on, for about a minute, I’ll briefly give in to self-pity about how unfair it all is and think about giving up. But I don’t. I may freeze up or escape through sleep for a while, but eventually I pick myself off, dust myself off and start all over again. I’m too responsible to give up!
“Working hard to develop your spiritual and psychic aptitude.” I try, but I still feel like a fake and a failure sometimes. No one is harder on me than I am. What I like best about this aspect, is that my faith has been
strengthened, not threatened by life’s challenges – I accept suffering
as a natural part of life and don’t consider those who suffer to be any
less spiritually evolved. Along with other aspects, it’s taught me
compassion. It’s also taught me not to place too much importance on the
things of the world or the illusion of worldly success.
Some of your descriptions related to my dad fit pretty well too.
Another good one, Michelle.
You must be very grounded though with Saturn in the 4th.
Thanks, Michelle. Grounded is a nice way of looking at it; sometimes I’m too grounded, I think. It never made sense to me when other astrologers would look at the lack of Earth (only Pluto/Ascendant) in my chart and assume I was ungrounded or impractical. I mean, I understood WHY they would think that, but it’s not me. I like that you get how my Saturn works.
Since I can never leave it at only one comment, I also wanted to add that I’ve periodically experienced authority figures as being weak,
deceptive, or incompetent. I don’t have any illusions about the law
either – sometimes it works and other times it’s just a sham. I’d
include many religious and political figures too. I know some people
may think that sounds cynical, but for me it’s more a matter of seeing
things as they are, without illusion. I think I started out in life
pretty naive (Saturn sits at the exact midpoint of my closest square,
that of Neptune/Mercury/Jupiter to my Moon) but have learned from
experience not to take anything at face value (Saturn in Sag/Neptune in
Scorpio). I noticed Hans Christian Anderson (author of “The Emperor’s
New Clothes”) had the semisquare just like me – makes sense! I think that’s one of the reasons I made a good professional “manager” – I was willing to do the work to be the real version people could depend on.
I also should have said how when I apply myself, I’m very serious about my art. I’m self-trained and it shows, but I like that my art has a very raw, self-revealing quality that people can relate to.
Sorry I keep repeating my placements, Michelle (I know you probably know
them by now – lol!) – I do it for anyone reading who might be trying to
learn from the comments.
I’m glad you (and everyone else) repeat your placements because it makes it easier for me to understand what you’re talking about in the moment.
7th house Saturn in Pisces sextile 3rd house Neptune in Scorpio.
Can relate to many of these at some point in my life including the here and now, except fleeing from authorities. Unless one includes that relentless voice in my head that says, “You really should do…
@msfullroller:disqus Do you readily take on positions of authority or would you rather avoid them?
I’d rather avoid them, because I see myself more from the point of one that plants seeds to stimulate the mind so that others can determine their own way. Positions of authority seem stifling to me and tend to reflect a “there is only one way…my way” flavor. However, I always seem to get placed in them.
Great delineations!
“Your ideal fantasy life is at odds with your real life. Duties and responsibilities
prevent you from fully taking off into flights of fancy. You feel prevented
from pursuing dreams. Pessimism and skepticism can prevent you from realizing
your dreams. Reality creeps into every fantasy. ”
I can certainly relate to the above. I always thought that it was weird how much real, practical concerns always seem to seep into my dream life. It kind of annoys me. LOL
I can definitely relate to these as well:
“Feeling responsible for the weak, ill and people who are down on their luck. Empathy
for those dealing with depression. Having compassion for those who also have a
hard time coping with life.”
I would like this to become my reality:
“Working hard to develop your artistic skills.”
I have Saturn in Cancer (11H) quincunx Neptune in Sagittarius (4H).
@Ebonystarr55:disqus
I always thought that it was weird how much real, practical concerns always seem to seep into my dream life. It kind of annoys me. LOL
You too? Lol
I would like this to become my reality:”Working hard to develop your artistic skills.”
With Saturn in the 11th part of the “making dreams come true” involves getting serious about long term planning and setting smaller achievable goals.
hi
I have Saturn(9) in Scorpio SEXTILE Neptune(11) in Sagittarius .
I dont know how it exactly manifests it self ,but after going through the article,I felt that ,I like to use my ideas and imagination in a way which can become a tangible,practical,structured thing which can be helpful to any singular person or to a society or group of people.
When it comes to explaining an idea or knowledge in a usable/implementing-way,I can feel this special energy to come out within me.Although there are few ideas,knowledge or philosophies that are so abstract that some amount of creativity is needed to present it in an usable form.I heard sextile aspects are not always felt as the trine or square aspects tend to be felt.
****Duties and responsibilities prevent you from fully taking off into
flights of fancy. You feel prevented from pursuing dreams. You feel that
you aren’t “allowed” to live your ideal life. Something prevents you
from letting go. Pessimism and skepticism can prevent you from realizing
your dreams.Adding glamor to real life. Wanting a storybook life. Fairy tales with life lessons. Having compassion for those who also have a hard time coping with life. Dad acts like a victim. Having a weak father ***** these are the few things sounds familiar to me !!!
its a good article
there are many dreams but I often get de-focused .I always feel that,dance,art, culture builds character,it disciplines life for good. Saturn wont let the talents go waste!!!
thankyou
@904db5f1d446fea5cc251690c0b46868:disqus
there are few ideas,knowledge or philosophies that are so abstract that some amount of creativity is needed to present it in an usable form
I like that. Neptune is abstract and Saturn is exact.
I think this combination may be related to higher math in the way that certain musicians are interested in the mathematics of music.
thankyou
Shakira: Saturn 13 Leo 25′ Rx trine Neptune 15 Sagittarius 37′
Cool! I have almost the same aspect as Shakira. ^_^
I have Saturn Leo 16’45 2nd house trine Neptune Sagittarius 12’57 6th house -4 orb, I think applying.
“What is real and what is an illusion? Reality is an illusion. Working hard to develop your artistic skills. Working hard to develop your spiritual and psychic aptitude.Materialism versus spirituality.Your ideal fantasy life is at odds with your real life.Reality creeps into every fantasy. Fantasy creeps into reality. Lack of ambition. Escaping the real world. Dad was a drunk.Getting involved with shady men.Otherworldly.Ungrounded.”
Yes, the above is all true.I can really feel both Saturn and Neptune though I think that Neptune comes through more prominently. I’m constantly at odds with myself about allowing my spirituality come through while still maintaining a realistic perspective. I also tend to want to express my spirituality through artistic expression and/or physical expression… I want to bring beauty and beautiful/mystical spirituality through into what we perceive as reality. I want to make the world a more beautiful place.<3
Frequently i use the phrases, "what we perceive as reality" in my sentences or "it's all in a person's perception or perspective" or something like that. =-) and I'm starting to think that everything that is considered fantasy is now our reality once it's been thought of and/or expressed in "physical" form..that includes verbal,art,dance, writing, etc. I dunno, maybe I'm being too unrealistic. =-) (bad joke, I know)
I know I probably sound ridiculous. ^_^ TMI
Frequently i use the phrases, “what we perceive as reality” in my sentences or “it’s all in a person’s perception or perspective” or something like that. =-)
Reality is such a matter of perception. Differences in perception happen all day, every day.
I agree
22 Virgo Saturn square 18 Sagittarius Neptune. I don’t always feel this aspect as much as do some of the others that I have written about. However, I do find that this aspect appears when it comes to my dreams (11th house Saturn) involving money or other materialism (2nd house Neptune). The key ideas that you present Michelle: “Practical dreamers. Practical fantasies. Taking concrete steps to realize your dreams. Materialism versus spiritually” are especially indicative of the Virgo/Sagittarius conflict of detailed practicality vs. spacey freedom.
Hello Michelle, Awesome website.
I have Saturn direct at 11.39 Leo 9th. applying to Neptune Rx at 15.05 Sagittarius 1st. The words that describe me most are…. ” Teaching how to dream. Dream instructors. Dream makers. Dreaming your life. Making it up as you go along. Pretending. Real life is an illusion. Reality is an illusion. Reality is malleable. Reality is what you make it. Building your ideal life. Glamorizing your reality. Trying to make your life seem more magical than it really is. Pragmatic fantasies. Using artistic skills in business. Working hard to develop your artistic skills. Working hard to develop your spiritual and psychic aptitude. Real life psychics. Your ideal fantasy life is at odds with your real life. Duties and responsibilities prevent you from fully taking off into flights of fancy. You feel prevented from pursuing dreams. You feel that you aren’t “allowed” to live your ideal life. Something prevents you from letting go. Undermining authority. Deceptive authorities. Victims of authority. Being victimized by your father. Dad acts like a victim. Victims of “the system.” Inability to take control of your own life. . Getting swept up in someone’s else’s attempts to structure your life. Looking for someone to give structure to your life. Looking for someone to help you get your feet on the ground. Floating. Ungrounded.” ……. These words perfectly describe my case now.
@478289905b7a8b7f53435bcd3a39caec:disqus Do you have a natal Saturn/Neptune aspect or are you experiencing a transiting right now?
Nice Take on Saturn and Neptune Aspects, thanks for passing this along here..!!
Michelle, this entry is superb as always. I was wondering where I could find the image at the top of the Mars-Pluto entry. It’s resonates very deeply with me. Thanks for all the entries.
Below is the link to the larger version. Unfortunately I don’t know the original source. I tried searching for it on tumblr but couldn’t find it.
http://astrofix.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/tumblr_lcf0k21tYZ1qcg9jho1_500.jpg
Thank you so very much.
I have this aspect, what I do is write poetry and stories about dreams. It is an escape for me.
@katley99 How do you write stories based on dreams? Do you make plots based on dream plots?
I have Saturn conjunct Neptune in the 9th… both Rx and in Capricorn. loosely conjunct Uranus, Trine ASC, Sextile Pluto, Opposition Mars, Quincunx Venus and Jupiter conjunction.
These really spoke to me:
The realities of fantasy. Dissolving reality.
Teaching how to dream. Dream makers. Dreaming your
life. Making it up as you go along. Pretending. Creating illusions in
plain sight. What is real and what is an
illusion? Real life is an illusion. Reality is an illusion. Reality is what you make it. Blurring the lines between what is real and what is fake.
Acting your way through life.
Otherworldly. Matter of
fact about spirituality. Working hard to develop your artistic
skills.
Materialism versus spirituality. Inability to
reconcile spiritual longings with practical concerns. Your ideal fantasy
life is at odds with your real life. Duties and responsibilities
prevent you from fully taking off into flights of fancy. You feel
prevented from pursuing dreams. Something prevents you from letting go. Pessimism
and skepticism can prevent you from realizing your dreams. Reality
creeps into every fantasy. Fantasy creeps into reality.
Lack of ambition. Escaping the real world. Feelings of futility. Why bother? Listless. Feeling that other people put their responsibilities
on you. Taking on too many duties out of an inability to set
appropriate boundaries. Empathy for those dealing with depression.
Having a hard time coping with life. Compassionate authority.
Being victimized by your father. Wanting
to escape from your father. Victims of “the system.” Tragic figures. Sad music. Depressing
fantasies. Overly
sensitive to harsh reality. Watching the
life you have built melt beneath your feet. Looking for someone to
give structure to your life. Floating. Ungrounded. Transient. Free
form. Fear of the unknown. Afraid of dissolving into nothingness.
This is very interesting.
These are a part of my yod. Definitely this is one of my biggest struggles and one of the harder aspects in my chart. I feel the potential for growth and yet limitations at the same time.
I have Neptune conjunct Saturn in Libra (along with Mercury) and EVERYTHING you’ve said is SO VERY TRUE! I’m an astrologer myself – but I couldn’t have put it nearly as well. Thanks.
Thank you Debra. It probably doesn’t hurt that I have Saturn sesquiquadrate Neptune.
I just checked out your blog – quite nice.
it make me cry……
I’m sorry
Which Saturn/Neptune aspect do you have?
example i have a saturn square neptune aspect it’s so bad and hard orb 7 46 but i feel the affect i think
I have both Saturn and Neptune conjunct in Capricorn. It seems this aspect is a tricky motherfucker! It seems like any plan that I have to make something out of my life lacks meaning or any real purpose. My plans seem futile and I become hopeless. On the other hand, spirituality seems too elusive and irrelevent in comparison to the real world of ambition and materialism.
I get the paradox that binds these two planets together and I also realize there are a lot of lessons in this aspect, like: time is an illusion and it takes discipline to live in the world with no resistance to what is.